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Post Info TOPIC: Self-Centeredness and Selfishness


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Self-Centeredness and Selfishness
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The Difference Between Self-centeredness and Selfishness




On of the great paradoxes in life as well as relationship is the concept of loving oneself and the concept of selfishness. There has always been great confusion in reconciling these two seemingly very different concepts.


There is no real relationship without loving oneself. Without the love of one's own self, self-love, we are not magically able to give what we don't have to another. Nor are we able to receive it from another. As deeply as we can love our self, that's how deeply we can enter into relationship with another. To truly love our self we have to be Self-centered - centered upon our highest Self, the God-Self, the light of Spirit within us. This contrasts sharply with self-centeredness, or selfishness, the preoccupation with our human personality and desires. Divine Selfishness, our highest Self-centeredness, allows more love to be available in our relationships with others. When we are centered upon the highest within ourselves, we can see the highest within our beloved. Human selfishness, on the other hand, takes us away from love. When we are centered upon our human desires, we live out of fear and try to get as much as we can from those we relate with, rather than wanting to give all we can.


The trick is to know the difference between divine Selfishness and human selfishness. It's not always obvious. Charles, one of our clients, felt a deep need to be alone, to take time apart from his partner, Connie. It seemed clear to him that this was a need of his soul, and was a manifestation of his love for himself — in other words, divine Selfishness. Connie, however, was in pain. In describing the events leading up to Charles' decision, it became clear that Charles was avoiding the expression of his own pain and anger. Connie was the only one expressing these "darker" emotions, and was longing to be met in these feelings by her partner. Instead, he was choosing to leave. While assuring himself he was leaving for "spiritual" reasons, he was ignoring (whether consciously or unconsciously) his fear of facing his own emotions.


Steven, on the other hand, also felt the need for time apart from Janice. He felt the relationship was becoming abusive and hurtful. Unlike Charles, he didn't repress his sadness, frustration and anger. Yet he felt hopeless and helpless to bring love into the relationship. He realized he had entered into the relationship for the wrong reason. He felt he was the only one who could take care of Janice, and forced himself to marry her for this reason. This of course backfired. Now he was feeling guilty about his own mistake, and this kept him in an unhealthy relationship. Counseling had failed to help them because he was failing to look at his lack of desire to really be with Janice. He learned that he wasn't being Self-centered enough. He was afraid of being selfish and hurting Janice. Yet by not being Selfish enough, he was hurting them both even more. When he was finally able to leave the relationship, both prospered by the opportunity to nurture their own souls — divine Selfishness.


Obviously, the choice between human selfishness and divine Selfishness is not about leaving or not leaving a relationship. More important are the day-to-day opportunities in the course of relationship. It is really the choice of living from the heart or living from fear. And how do you live from fear? Saying "yes" when your heart wants to say "no." Saying "no" when your heart wants to say "yes." By not listening to your heart (i.e., what is best for your soul), you compromise your truth, and cause suffering in the relationship. You may be afraid of hurting your friend. You may be afraid of losing their love and friendship. Whatever it is you are afraid of, it is still fear that is ruling you, rather than love.


We know a man who freely spends money on his wife, but seldom spends money on anything meaningful for himself. This, he reasons, is avoiding selfishness. On the contrary, this is a symptom of lack of love for self. He thinks he is being generous but, without first being generous with himself, he cannot truly be generous with another. His very fear of selfishness is causing him to be selfish. Remember, fear is the root of human selfishness. Love is the root of divine Selfishness.


Therefore, in every decision that needs to be made, ask what love would have you do. If the decision is right for your soul, then it will be right for the relationship, too. If you are loving and honoring your own heart, then you can't help but do the same for another. If you are being divinely Selfish, you will be helping everyone around you.



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"LOVE" devoid of self-gratification, is in essence, the will, to the greatest good...of another.


MIP Old Timer

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Wow Phil, that's alot to think about. It also made me clarify some things I suspected were going on with me but was afraid to really look at. Good post, thank yu. lv Chris



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Phil-


Thanks for the fabulous post!  Could not have posted at a better time.  Gave me a lot to think about! 


I’ve been feeling depressed and disgusted looking back at my alcohol induced behavior… how I have portrayed myself and hurt others.  This has caused me to kind of curl up within myself.  I should feel good not drinking, but I have not been able to address my real issues yet and now feel like a plant un-watered.  (Okay, I know, not a good analogy, but you get the idea.)


Anyhow, I was really struggling yesterday regarding this issue.  I went out to eat with my boyfriend and then we got a movie.  I should have had a good time, but the whole while I was feeling distant and kind of depressed.  It did come to my mind that I needed to put more into me in order to be able to give him anything back.  I have NEVER felt like this before last week when I stopped drinking and looked critically at my behavior.  Again, a shock to the system. 


I will be addressing this at my meeting today, (if appropriate as I have never went to this meeting before).  But, I was wondering, is this normal to feel this way right after taking a step back and self analyzing?  Like you mentioned, "there is no real relationship without loving oneself", and again I know I can't beat myself up too much, but I can't help but feel disgusted by my actions.  I don't feel that connection to myself that I once thought I had therefore am feeling very distant to others.  HELP!!


-Jana



 



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Hi....


All I really know for sure Jana is...."its ok to feel how you feel..."


And I dont have any answers....


I can still go back into yesterdays...with guilt and remorse...and regrets..and kick my ass all over the place...they call them emotional hangovers...


And it can send this kids self esteem and self worth...right down the drain...into depression


I do think that it has something to do with the "Im a bad person...instead of a sick person" and two steps forward and one step backward..


I havent had a drink in many many days...


However it took 18 years to learn how to show love...feelings..and emotions...through AA and outside counselling


Today I am learning..that Im human...and that I dont need to wear masks...and be someone..that Im not...

I dont need to be a strong macho sober asshole...


Fourth..fifth..sixth...and seventh step are big ones...


I have learned that to show love...I must have it to give...


I cannot obtain love from anyone else first...Then..it becomes an emotional need..


I cannot obtain happiness from others either...I must learn to be comfortable..and fairly contented..within my own skin...first..


I am not in a relationship at present....I was always one to rebound....put the walls up...and keep on trucking....looking for something, outside myself....instead of inside..


I can admit.. that Im not capable of a relationship right now....because..Im still working on a relationship..with myself...(and a Higher Power)..and the 11th step...


I have learned that while doing that....that giving and helping others...with no expectations in return...or ulterior motives...helps me with the process...between self centerdness, and selfishness.


One day at at a time gal....and still learning about life.....sober....and its neverending...


You have a good day...


 



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PS...Forgiving oneself, is sometimes difficult....I still have a problem with it, some days....but I do believe, that it is a must...before we can move forward...

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"LOVE" devoid of self-gratification, is in essence, the will, to the greatest good...of another.


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Thanks Phil.  Much appreciated.  Looks like I have a lot of work to do. 


-Jana



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Hi Phil and Jana,


Wow, this was such an excellent read.


Took me back to that initial dilema, when I first heard the Words "Self-Love" it almost hit my gag reflex.  I had walked into AA, for keeps with a commitment to keep my mind open, but on this one, just felt so amazingly Stumped. 


I recall so clearly, that in a figurative way, I would walk into the rooms carrying such bigs volumms of Self-Hate, that they were hard to carry.


So with this being a personal Delemma, I made a decision, that if I was ever to find that emotion of Self-Love, that I was just going to leave it in the Hands of my Higher Power, that I choose to call God. If I were ever to discover any Self-Love, He would have to be the Giver of that.


And as time had gone by, working these Steps, I recall that it was in doing a very rigerous 4th Step,at the end of my first year,  and then the following Cleansing feeling with doing the 5th Step, that a lot of the old toxic Shame stuff came out, and there was so much inside self hate attached to that old worn out shame.


Then came the Process of Beginning Treatment for PTSD, and all those demons from the past were going away, slowly, one by one, each trauma memory would pluck out one of those friggen demons, once faced, they would evaporte, never ever to return. So it was the working of the Steps, in order, and to the best of my ability, and with the God given Gift of some Therapy with a woman, that today, remains my Spiritual Guide.


So today, I can say those self-hate volumns are all gone.  And the self worth that I feel does feel solid, only when I let it be in the Process of Loving God, with all my Heart, and able able to have the freedom to love others, without reservations. That would only be possible with putting God first in everything, and with the Process of Trusting God, in everything, there is no longer that horrible fear of others, that was also there in the beginning.


And Jana, what a journey you are beginning.  The Program of Alcoholics Anonymous, and the working of the 12 Steps pulls us up out of the old patterns that just went along with all the drinking.


Looking also back at that self-hate, it was not all a bad thing, I think it was disliking pretty intensely the person I had become. The dishonest, the manipulation of others, to get what I wanted, The Ego in Action is how I think of that.


 Being completely honest with others is now so very important to me, and as Tim wrote, last week, "Say what you mean, and feel what you feel, for those who matter, won't mind, and those who mind, won't matter".  Very powerful concept.


These days, thanks to God, that person that walked into the Rooms of AA, with a commitment to do what ever it took, was willing to go to ANY Lengths, and did follow the suggestions of others (Most of the time, haha) The person that was a Black out Drunk and looking at the end of my life, that was the feeling,  holding onto that sick ego, that was me.


There is a saying that AA will remove two things in your life, the Drinking, and the Bondage of Self.


I still love and use the meetings of Alcoholic Anonymous, try to make at least 3 meetings every week,  for they keep me so close to the fellowship, and sometimes that does not mean the people, in the rooms, but to the 12 Principles that sit side by side, the 12 Steps, that are the work steps, that you will see at every meeting. The principles can also be thought of as working them too, in how we must continue to preceive and honor this Program. 


So happy to see you beginning your journey here. And just let every emotion that you feel be there, it can be so very difficult in the beginning, with the sense of confusion, but it does all get better, Jana, if it did not offer the Promise of the freedom from all that you are going through, I don't think to many people would stick around.


If we can keep Sobriety, in Front of Everything, no matter what, chances are VERY good that you can stay Sober.  If you put something, Anything in Front of that Sobriety, chances are that you will not be able to keep your Sobriety, I just wanted to share that with you today, for they were the words, that turned on the Lights, for this Alke, that had a history of just going back to Alcohol, so many times, I can't even count that far. 


Just want to say I enjoyed this Post, and you imput along with Phil's,  great Stuff.


A Big hug to you dear.


Toni


P.S. The movie, "When a man Loves a Woman" is very real, and goes into a lot of what you are going through right now,  as well as what your Boyfriend's emotions might be, as you go through the changes that are going on inside you. 



-- Edited by Toni Baloney at 19:15, 2006-09-02

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I wish you guys were at my AA meetings!!  I have only found one group that I feel really good about.  (I'll keep checking different meetings out, it's still early).  I think it's kind of the side of town I am in though.


Anyhow, you really help me to put things in perspective.  I can't wait to find a great sponsor.  Still looking!  I need to start working those steps.  


At my meeting today, I told a woman of my current battle/ struggles.  A lot of what she said related to dealing with resentment towards others.  Again, my resentment is not directed towards others but at myself.  So, much of what she said did not really apply.  But, she had mentioned that each day I have a CHOICE for my mindset, and it may be challenging at first, but I have to make the most of each day. 


Now when I walked into this meeting, I thought, "Am I really going to relate to these people?"  Many of them had mentioned that they just got out of homeless shelters, etc.  But, after going to this meeting, my outlook on the day changed.  ((Slap))...((Slap))...I was slapped in the face with the reality of the situation.  Get a grip, and deal with it....  I could either sit around feeling sorry for myself, or make the best of my circumstances.  Now I don't know if I will attend that particular meeting again...but I am happy I went today.


Thank you both for helping!!! 


-Jana   


 



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