I posted to Rob the other day that if he needs help with getting straight he shouldn't reject the 'Valium concept'. And upon reflection, I feel obliged to admit that (if you will pardon the expression) I was talking out of my ass. Anyone who is an alcoholic will (in my opinion) probably end up addicted to Valium if they ever get their hands on it.
I know I certainly have become addicted to Valium, not severely (ie, I'm not popping them: I stick to the supposedly 'therapeutic' dose) but it's still a major pain: I've been trying to to wean myself off them for about a year. And even (or especially) if I'm not drinking, it seems really, really tough to get by without them. As Toni says, they are 'powered alcohol'.
I do think however, that these sorts of drugs do have a role in the VERY short term, and ONLY in severe cases - that is, if a person is having terrible alcohol withdrawals, fitting, hallucinations, DTs etc.
Rob: if you read this, I don't think that's you. That is, I don't get the impression that you are really physically dependent on the booze. I would not, however, rule out seeing a doctor and fronting up about your booze probs. Of course, there are "doctors", and then there are doctors. But personally, since I have been taking Evanza (an anti depressant) my urge to drink has settled, I feel more peaceful, and I sleep well.
I know this sort of therapy is not on a par with the sort of radical re-invention of yourself that a proper committment to AA enables a person to make. And I suspect that I will be back in AA at some point, as even though I've cut back on the booze since starting on Evanza, I'm still not a happy camper at all when it comes to drink, and I suspect I've never even made the 1st basic step of admitting that I am an alcoholic. I'm just not sure....sometimes I'm fine when I drink, other times not. Sometimes I can stop, other times I can't. I think the point that I actually worry about it to the extent that I do probably points to the fact that I am alcoholic.
Anyway. Just wanted to say that about Valium: NOT the answer, unless circumstances are extreme, and in most cases, I suspect, Valium would only complicate the addiction problems. Anti-depressants are a different story since they are not euphoric or 'feel good' in that immediate sort of way, and I have known people who have really picked themselves up with the help of things like Prozac.
I'm NOT knocking AA at all here. Obviously the best thing is to be straight without drugs of any kind. But sometimes there are complicating factors that contribute towards the boozing - like mood disorders, and I personally don't see (others may disagree with me) why people who suffer from mood disorders like depression, or bipolar, and therefore drink, shouldn't take advantage of the effective drug therapies that are available.
There is a book on the market, called "I'm dancing as fast as I can" about a famous News Anchor Woman that was addicted to Valium, and what happened to her, when she made a decision to quit, cold turkey.
As a former Addict of Valium, it was what I used, not as a Tranquilizer, but for my horrible hangovers. I have total recall of them acting like Brain Frosting, just pouring down over my brain, and knocking out the worst part of the hangover- however, they also took me out of reality, like a super-imposed feeling of everything being completely o.k., when that was the last thing, that was reality.
When I moved up to Seattle, Washington, I went to a Doctor, and told him that they had been prescibed by a conservative Doctor for my anxieties. He looked at me and paused, and said, Well, I will give you one presciption, but I am NOT your new Drug Dealer. I was busted. had to do the cold turkey withdrawal, and it was absolutely so friggen hard, then I heard, when I had survived this horrible ordeal, that took about 6 months of Back-Lash Anxiety, where I could barely function, and sometimes not at all, I heard then, that the withdrawal was similar to the withdrawal of Heroin.
Turned out to be a blessing in disguise, for it accelerated my Alcohol use, so fast, that, that is when I started drinking, 80%, 24/7. A fast slide into hell is how I recall those days, straight into Blackout Drunk Status. My Suicide attempts were with Valium, and Alcohol, 2 of them, and then on my third try, it led to a final surrender to giving up, could not die, could not live, that is when AA, and a Professional started working one day at a time, a very slow climb out of the big black hole of Cross-Addiction.
If you go to AA meetings, there is Printed material on being Cross addicted, and it states that it is a more complex, recovery, because the person will trade, or give up one, and use the other, or the other way around, stop the other, and use the other.
A visious circle. if I had it to do over, I would have asked for Medical help in the withdrawal.
The Book I referred you to, is a great read on the subject of Valium, and it's insidious Nature and over-whelming POWER to trick the brain, into thinking, "Things aren't as bad as they are." At least when you are drunk, you KNOW you are drunk, or you remember the next day, if you were REALLY Drunk.
And your referencing me as stating Valium is Powered Alcohol, came from a Woman that worked in the field of Addiction, at Ross Hospital, in California, and it was in a question and answer talk, on why Benzodiazipines should NEVER be used in the withdrawal phase of Drug and Alcohol Detox. Valium was the very worst of them, according to her, and she was a specialist in Cross Addiction.
My experience ~ I was placed on Valium in 2004, after having major back surgery. I was told it was to alleviate stress and relax me so I could heal. Little did I know, and they didn't tell me, it's addictive to some immediately. It took 2 days of taking 1 pill 2x a day for me to "need" it. It put me into the blackest cloud I'd ever been under. This was the only time in my life I literally contemplated suicide. Then getting off it was a nightmare. Honestly, I'd rather have a hair hurting hangover from booze any day than try to detox off Valium ever again! The 'script should bare a skull and cross bones, IMO........
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Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass... It's about learning to dance in the rain.
Well for me it began, when I had a very crazy person, coming around my house, almost everynite. The Police had to get invoved, and they did, but I could not sleep for five minutes, and my Doctor told me to take one at night, so I could at least get 4 hours sleep.
That nightmare ended when I moved into my "to be" Husband's home, and out of the area. Did not drink anything at that time, was way too scared of the guy. And was on this adenelin alert everyday, that took it toll on my nervous system. And yep, no one told me, well you can get on them, but you cannot get off of them.
I moved to an area in Tiburon, California, with the doors and windows open all the time, and had no need to continue taking them, but I could not get off of them. So my husband and I drank Wine with dinner, everynight, and I still needed those friggers to go to sleep.
As dangerous in my book, as Heroin, and that seems funny, cause in all my Drugie Days, with a little cocaine, a little pot, with the wine, I vowed to never ever try Heroin, way way too scary for me. Little did I know I was taking something that the withdrawal was going to be about the same.
Sycorax, I do Prayer thay you talk to a Doctor about getting some help with this incideous drug, remember months ago, I gave you in PM the whole story of my own cross addition to this Drug and alcohol merry- go- round. Anyone can get off of this medication, but in my opinion, it takes the help of a good Doctor.
In the 60's, I did not take this drug then, but I do remember the prase of "Mother's Little Helpers", that is what they were called then. That book I am referring to was on the Best Seller's list for over a year.
I can not believe that this medication has not been banned by the AMA.
Anyway thanks for you imput. Hope your back is getting better, day by day.
I will try to find the documentation for this, but we were discussing Valium in a clinical pharmacology class at Kent State University a few years ago and according to some information my professor had, Valium was widely used in the 60's, to help detox and 'cure' women alcoholics. Instead of drinking, all the alcoholic homemaker of the day had to do was pop a Valium and she would amazingly not have the need to drink...!! Instead of being an unsightly drunken mess in the community, she would be more 'subdued' and 'behaved'.... I can just see the line of thinking at the time... "June Cleaver-type in A-pattern skirt and apron no longer cussing a blue streak and hollering out the windows at the neighbors whilste tearing the house up and slapping the husband... now she is amazingly calm and pleasent, lolling on the sofa after the lunchtime dishes are done...."
I am not making light of Valium-dependence. But the medical world has some crazy ideas when releasing new 'wonder drugs', such as Valium was once thought to be. I myself have been waiting for the AMA, FDA, whoever- to get off their arses and outlaw Oxycoton.... but that's another ball of wax too.... Just because something is prescribed does not by any means imply that it is safe... but boy, if it will make the drug companies a lot of money.....???
I am thinking of you and feeling a lot of compassion for you. I pray for your healing and freedom from this pill-insanity.
This post has taken me back to what it was like. I've detoxed off benzo's and heroin. Nothing nice at all. Heroin is definitely worse short term but the colonopin messed me up for a long time, threw my whole nervous system out of whack. God I hope I never have to go through anything like that again. Horrible, horrible, horrible. If anyone is thinking about taking addictive narcotics whether doctor prescribed or not, if you are an alcoholic, you better be damn careful! That's all I got to say about that!
the prase of "Mother's Little Helpers", that is what they were called then.
I had to chuckle a bit when I read this, my mind went immediately to that Jefferson Airplane song ~ "white rabbit" I believe it is........then I remembered something, in 1974, I was 8 yrs old, my parents had been divorced about a year and my own mother became 'ill'. My sister and I lived with my grandparents for 3-4 months because my mother was in our local hospital. It was not until I was in my late 20's that I found out she was not so much 'ill' but was 'detoxing' from valium........as for my back surgery this time, it has gone well. I did take their morphine injections after surgery, but came home with a 'script for muscle relaxers only and haven't had one of those in a month or more.
-- Edited by Doll at 08:51, 2006-07-16
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Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass... It's about learning to dance in the rain.
