Hi guys! I came across this and am interested to know your "take" on it?
Doll
Ottawa program offers drinks to homeless alcoholics Last Updated Mon, 02 Jan 2006 21:37:10 EST CBC News
Shelters across the country are taking a closer look at an Ottawa shelter that gives drinks to homeless alcoholics after a study suggested the program is having a positive impact.
Dr. Tiina Podymow envisioned the program after volunteering with chronic alcoholics, including some who drank upwards of 40 drinks per day, including mouthwash.
Two men in the program receive their drinks at an Ottawa shelter. Participants in the Managed Alcohol Project were given permanent beds in a shelter and, from 7 a.m. to 11 p.m, allowed to have one drink of homemade wine or beer per hour, carefully measured out at a dispensary counter.
Now a study published in this week's edition of the Canadian Medical Association Journal is raising interest in the program.
Completed by the shelter's medical director, Dr. Jeff Turnbull, the study examined the program's impact on 17 residents. Most had been alcoholics for 35 years before starting the program.
His study found:
Participants who typically drank 46 drinks a day before the program dropped to about eight drinks a day during the program. The number of emergency room visits fell by 36 per cent. The number of encounters with police were essentially halved, falling by 51 per cent.
Critics say there's no way to judge how effective the harm-reduction approach is because there's no comparison group in the study, such as people taking part in an abstinence program like Alcoholics Anonymous.
But Turnbull says the aim of the program is not complete abstinence.
"We always try to encourage people to stop drinking but we are realistic," said Turnbull. "These are people who have spent 20 to 30 years on the street and trying to get them to stop alcohol is not possible at this time."
Others question the reasoning behind the program.
"If this works for alcoholism and you can keep your streets cleaner and safer, then what is stopping you from doing it for cocaine addicts or crystal meth people?" asked Brian Venables, with the Salvation Army.
Podymow says she understands the criticism.
"I would totally agree the best treatment is to stop completely. But if the person with the disease isn't going to stop, what else is the plan?" she said.
Tim Hogan says he'd like to give up drinking but doesn't think he's ready.
"I would like to throw that bottle into the Rideau [Canal] and never come back for it, but knowing me I'd throw the bottle in and I'd probably jump in the Rideau to go get it," said Hogan.
The program has been successful for others.
Wendy Cooper and Jimmy Smyth went through the program together and are now both completely dry.
"If it wasn't for the program I seriously say I would've been dead by now," said Cooper.
With a year-long waiting list to get into the program, several shelters in other cities are interested in adopting it.
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* We eventually realize that just as the pains of alcoholism had to come before sobriety, emotional turmoil comes before serenity. *
"I got tight that night, stayed sober Monday till after the dinner and then proceeded to get tight again. I drank all I dared in the bar, and then went to my room to finish the job. Tuesday I started in the morning, getting well organized by noon. I did not want to disgrace myself, so I then checked out. I bought some more liquor on the way to the depot. I had to wait some time for the train. I remember nothing from then on until I woke up at a friend's house, in a town near home. These good people notified my wife, who sent my newly-made friend over to get me. He came and got me home and to bed, gave me a few drinks that night, and one bottle of beer the next morning." (And who was the AA friend who gave him a few drinks that night, and one bottle of beer the next morning? Could it have been.....our founder?)
I also recall seeing on this forum, someone saying that they were advised not to stop drinking cold turkey, until they got to the treatment center and under supervised medical care.
I would only hope that the program in Ottowa, would include, at least, the requirement that those getting the 1 drink per hour, would have to listen to education in regards to alcoholism at least once a day. This could also include hearing veteran AA speakers tell their story.
*****I do want everyone to know that , this"Legend" of this man was a topic of many, many people I have met over the years, in AA, I have written what I has been told to me, repeated to me by Alcoholics, and even thou I did meet Duffy in person and did attend some of the "open to public" barbecues, I am repeated these stories, third hand.
Just a little imput on the subject. There was this Recovery Home, up in the wine Country,North of Marin County, called Duffy's. Duffy ran this home for about 30 years before he died about 8 years ago. Anyway, what he would do with the really heavy Alcoholic drinker, during detox,(something like what described in you Post) he would give them a shot of whiskey every hour.
After a couple of days, he would reduce to l shot every 2 hours, then 1 every three, when he had reduced the shots down to 1 every 5 or 6 hours then they were told they had to go from there cold turkey........And THEN came the Program of Recovery.
There was always a waiting list to get in to that house, and it was really a big spawling house on a ranch.
Duffey was really loved all over the Bay area, and in the month of July, every year he would come to Marin and Speak at meetings at a church in Marin, on Wednesday nights. Every Sunday, in the Summer months, there was a free, all you could eat, Barbecue, at his Ranch And always Standing Room Only. Followed by a very very big AA Meeting.
His clientele would go back, not to drink, but to thank him and offer a helping vounteer hand for the work he was doing, He had so much love for all that came though his house, and that loved would be returned. AND, the most important fact, was that his success Rate was ranked number one in the entire San Francisco bay area.
There were several Recovery Homes in the bay area, and 3 detox centers, All requiring complete abstinance.
Marin is an area that has a lot alcoholics that still lived in houses, but homeless and bankrupt spiritually.
So, It is my opinion that the people in Canada are on to something that seems to work, with better success for the person that is in the *Third stage (*just my opinion) of this disease.
This article left me with many unanswered questions. It didn't mention a recovery program being the end result, (or did I miss something?) so does this mean folks will be lining up to get free drinks? And what happens between 11PM and the next morning? If it were me, I'd be out them doors looking for more !
The BB tells us that the bottle is just a symptom of what is really going on. So, if those issues are not dealt with won't the problem still be there? Even for the 2 that got sober, if they're not dealing with the "causes" will they not "go back out"?
I totally agree that most should not go Cold Turkey alone. Medical care is needed for this. I was a binge drinker and remember all too well how I started to feel around day 3 without a drink.......
On the other hand, I had a friend who WANTED to get off cocaine, so everytime she craved a line, she set the egg timer for 10 minutes and made herself wait until that 10 min. was up, then snorted. She did this for a few days, then increased the egg timer to 15, 20, 30, 60 and so on. It took a while, but she's coke free and has been for 14 years. What made the difference, she WANTED to be clean.
Thanks, all........these discussions are awesome........Wonderful exercise for my brain.
Hugs,
Doll
-- Edited by Doll at 07:02, 2006-01-04
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* We eventually realize that just as the pains of alcoholism had to come before sobriety, emotional turmoil comes before serenity. *
This Place and story reminds me of the first days of AA like stated above. It also reminds me of what they are trying to do in England with the hard core addicts. At the end of my drinking I just went cold turkey and to AA. But I also was not drinking 41 drinks a day. What do we do with our homeless and hard core alcoholics who cannot stop drinking. Do we let them die on the streets? I think that like all of us that are at or where at different stages of our drinking that there must be different styles of recovery or maintenance. I tried to do the maintenance drinking only drinking 2-4 a day. Alcoholism still got me and I wanted to stop all drinking. I found a way that helps "me" by AA meetings, a shrink and coming to recovering boards. It does not matter how far down the scail we have gone,some may never stop drinking all the way. Thank God that someone or a place is willing to help those who cannot stop.
